[A2k] Europe Wants 20% European Content on Netflix

Seth Johnson seth.p.johnson at gmail.com
Sat May 28 01:26:34 PDT 2016


Hmm, can't say I understand the disconnect.  The cable model imposed
on telecom is how this came about.  I'd say that matters quite a lot.
You'd have to tell me what the holes are for you, and in what line of
reasoning, from what to what.

On Sat, May 28, 2016 at 3:30 AM, Michael Gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com> wrote:
> Seth,
>
> I don't disagree with anything you've written below but I don't see what that has to do with the original subject of the thread (or the continuing subject line...
>
> M
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Seth Johnson [mailto:seth.p.johnson at gmail.com]
> Sent: May 27, 2016 11:37 PM
> To: Michael Gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com>
> Cc: Stephen Wyber <Stephen.Wyber at ifla.org>; Denise Nicholson <Denise.Nicholson at wits.ac.za>; A2k <a2k at lists.keionline.org>; Teresa Hackett <teresa.hackett at eifl.net>; Evelyn Woodberry <evewoodberry at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [A2k] Europe Wants 20% European Content on Netflix
>
> It's a network now where we (anyone opening a port and offering a service at the edge) can't expect our packets to get through to subscribers who have already paid for capacity on their end.  And where Netflix has knuckled under and negotiated with incumbents all over the world to get their packets through.  It's not just the Netflix "content model" for the case of one app; it's no longer an open network of networks that supports any app you come up with, and in which in some cases edge providers may opt to purchase distributed optimization from local CDNs; it's a world in which everybody who wants to do something at higher capacity has to negotiate with diverse incumbents throughout the world just to get through.  The Netflix model has now been imposed on the entire network.
>
> On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 10:16 PM, Michael Gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com> wrote:
>> But isn't the Netflix content model (the models of various other
>> similar providers that of cable TV). They provide and we pay for a
>> "channel" which happens to be delivered via the Internet but could
>> equally (from a content point of view) be delivered via cable or even
>> over the air?  Netflix even restricts access on a country by country
>> basis, attempting only partially successfully to prevent Canadians
>> from using VPN's etc. to access the rather more substantial offerings of Netflix USA.
>>
>>
>>
>> The French law seems quite reasonable on that basis.
>>
>>
>>
>> M
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Seth Johnson [mailto:seth.p.johnson at gmail.com]
>> Sent: May 27, 2016 1:10 PM
>> To: Michael Gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com>
>> Cc: Stephen Wyber <Stephen.Wyber at ifla.org>; Denise Nicholson
>> <Denise.Nicholson at wits.ac.za>; A2k <a2k at lists.keionline.org>; Teresa
>> Hackett <teresa.hackett at eifl.net>; evewoodberry at gmail.com
>> Subject: Re: [A2k] Europe Wants 20% European Content on Netflix
>>
>>
>>
>> Right.  In relation to cable, which came into existence largely in the
>> 80's, we first developed rules where cable had to provide a certain
>> amount of local programming, then established the precept of
>> retransmission consent -- for cable and its programming model.  Cable
>> television providers have had a unique relationship to infrastructure,
>> being "vertically integrated" from their origins.  It's not a regime
>> that supports autonomous peers and ready access at the physical layer.
>>
>> As a legacy from television, adapted to cable, the rules have some
>> rationality.  As a foundation for the Internet, they don't.  Unless
>> you no longer want a network of autonomous peers that anyone can readily join.
>> However, the US (and the EU is just now getting explicit on this) has
>> engineered federal policy for Title II infrastructure so it "looks like"
>> facilities-based/cable/vertically integrated telecom infra since the
>> start of the 2000's.  Part of what happened was the network of
>> networks was eliminated (since independent ISPs couldn't lease the
>> lines on equitable terms), so we now have a vertically integrated
>> dominant incumbent intranet on both sides, Title II and cable.  With
>> the network of independent peers gone, our policymakers have been free
>> to proceed with encouraging the facilities-based model on both sides,
>> including setting things up so retransmission consent becomes a legal basis for the broadcasters treaty.
>>
>>
>>
>> It's premature to endorse any content-related policy until we get the
>> actual Internet back.  Then we need to address what that means for
>> "content"-related policy.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 2:39 PM, Michael Gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> We have had Canadian content CanCon laws in place for decades.  At
>>
>>> first controversial (usual bleating by neo-lib ideologues and those
>>
>>> living off mainlining US content into Canada), most now agree they
>>
>>> have been somewhat successful in building a small but vital Canadian
>>
>>> movie industry, enabling a place for Canadian writers in Canadian
>>> (and
>>
>>> now international) bookstores/distributors, supporting Canadian TV
>>
>>> talent (a lot of which has ended up in the US) and particularly in
>>
>>> supporting a flourishing Canadian music industry.
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Perhaps a useful model.
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> M
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>
>>> From: A2k [mailto:a2k-bounces at lists.keionline.org] On Behalf Of
>>
>>> Stephen Wyber
>>
>>> Sent: May 27, 2016 12:44 AM
>>
>>> To: Denise Nicholson <Denise.Nicholson at wits.ac.za>; Seth Johnson
>>
>>> <seth.p.johnson at gmail.com>; A2k <a2k at lists.keionline.org>;
>>
>>> teresa.hackett at eifl.net; evewoodberry at gmail.com
>>
>>> Subject: Re: [A2k] Europe Wants 20% European Content on Netflix
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Hi,
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Fascinating - especially given that in France it appears that there
>>> is
>>
>>> a fair movement against the Loi Toubon quotas implemented a good few
>>
>>> years back on radio. Clearly the format is different, but the
>>
>>> argument<http://www.lemonde.fr/actualite-medias/article/2015/09/25/ch
>>> a
>>
>>> nson-francophone-les-radios-montent-le-ton-contre-le-durcissement-des
>>> -
>>
>>> quotas_4771286_3236.html> runs that this tended to lead to only a
>>
>>> small number of French songs being played repeatedly on some
>>> stations,
>>
>>> while elsewhere the quality of output fell given the protection the
>>
>>> quotas offered from competition. And of course the most successful
>>
>>> artists sang in English anyway...
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Thanks,
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Stephen
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>
>>>
>>
>>> From: A2k [mailto:a2k-bounces at lists.keionline.org] On Behalf Of
>>> Denise
>>
>>> Nicholson
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Sent: 26 May 2016 19:30
>>
>>>
>>
>>> To: Seth Johnson <seth.p.johnson at gmail.com>; A2k
>>
>>> <a2k at lists.keionline.org>; teresa.hackett at eifl.net;
>>
>>> evewoodberry at gmail.com
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Subject: Re: [A2k] Europe Wants 20% European Content on Netflix
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Hi,
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> South African Broadcasting Corporation recently made a decision that
>>
>>> 90% of music played on radio has to be local content. The draft
>>
>>> Copyright Bill proposed 80% but I have been told it may be 70% in the
>>
>>> revised Bill which is due to go to Cabinet very soon.
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> See:
>>
>>> http://mg.co.za/article/2016-05-12-sa-music-to-dominate-radio-as-sabc
>>> -
>>
>>> announces-90-local-policy
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Regards
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Denise
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> ________________________________________
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> From: Seth Johnson [seth.p.johnson at gmail.com]
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Sent: 24 May 2016 11:56 PM
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> To: A2k
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Subject: [A2k] Europe Wants 20% European Content on Netflix
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> Europe thinks Internet is cable. Note that this dovetails exactly
>>> with
>>
>>> cable TV tradition as well as the notion of the broadcasters treaty
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> http://www.euractiv.com/section/digital/news/commission-wants-netflix
>>> -
>>
>>> to-carry-at-least-20-european-content/
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
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>>
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